I have my natal Sun in Libra, the sign of relationship, conjunct Chiron in Libra and have spent many years analyzing what makes us tick when it comes to relating to others.
OK, I admit out-of-sign aspects bug the heck out of me because I don’t like going by the numbers, i.e. if a planet is 90 degrees from another planet regardless of the signs, it is square. This is just my own personal preference because I know plenty of astrologers who are very happy with using the numbers alone.
Since we have two very high profile planets – Jupiter and Uranus – about to leave Pisces for Aries, this is a very good time to observe the effects by transit. There is nothing subtle about either Jupiter or Uranus, which is why they are often used to rectify charts, that is determine the correct time of birth using events in one’s life. The shift from Pisces who prefers to work quietly in the background to Aries who often yells at the top of his lungs is BIG change.
Right now Uranus at 29° Pisces is exactly inconjunct my Sun. When it moves into Aries tomorrow, May 27 at 6:44 PM PDT, I’m going to be on full alert and pay close attention to how I feel and what happens. If the pressure lifts and I start feeling freed up to charge ahead (very Aries) then I will conclude the sign is more important than the numbers.
Orbs are very, very critical too and the longer I work with them, the smaller I feel they need to be. An orb of one or two degrees is often the most accurate, especially for transits and between planets in the sky at any given time. I feel this is especially important when dealing with the outer planets – Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune and Pluto. Karen, whose work with the asteroids I very much respect, always recommends using a one or two degree orb for those also. Consistency is important too. We can’t use five to ten degree orbs for one chart just to reflect our personal prejudices about one sign or planet either. Sloppy thinking.
I will note I do use slightly wider orbs in synastry because different people work with their natal planets in different ways. But when it comes to composite charts, it is back to one-two degree orbs largely because those are composed of calculated points, not living planets or people.
I welcome feedback on this subject because I know astrology can be as much Art as Science and as astrologers, we are human beings first and foremost. What works for one may not for another . . . yup, equitable Libra to the end. 
I’d like to say “Thank you” to Karen Anderson for including Libra Seeking Balance on her list of Fifty Best Astrology Blogs. Quite an honor.
I’m a numbers gal for sure! Especially when it comes down to Jupiter and beyond. It seems to take the planets a few degrees to settle in, make themselves at home – so you have this 4-5 or so degree window, when an energy ingresses before it seems to relax. That anaretic degree is so strong, it just seems to dominate the equation for a while really. I also don’t get the wide orb thing! I am very strict with orbs as you know and I also don’t get the excessive usage of aspects, it always seems to make like a forcing of a story to make an energy fit what is wanted to be there, not working with the basics. BUT most people think the asteroids are 10,000 of un-influential space junk, so who am I criticise!
Interesting about the anaretic degree. We are getting a nice little lesson in both anaretic & critical degrees over the next week or so.
It always seems to make like a forcing of a story to make an energy fit what is wanted to be there, not working with the basics.
This is human nature at work IMO. Sometimes we want what we want so bad we will do just about anything to get there. I run into this all the time doing synastry work. If the aspects aren’t there, they AREN’T THERE. Type ‘A’ people have a much harder time accepting oranges are not apples and never will be.
diane~
*it always seems to be a forcing
dern one cup of coffee!!!
I’m with you here. I give the sun and moon wider orbs in a natal chart, but beyond those it’s down to 2 degrees or so. But I’m also one of those empirical people who tries to read a chart rather than “reading into” it.
There is an art to it, absolutely; all the more reason that a system needs good boundaries to be reliable. *coughsaturninlibraherecough*
Hey Shannon!
But I’m also one of those empirical people who tries to read a chart rather than “reading into” it.
ROFL!!! The further my Sun progresses into Capricorn, the fonder I am of empirical.
There is an art to it, absolutely; all the more reason that a system needs good boundaries to be reliable. *coughsaturninlibraherecough*
YES!!! I’ve always been a big fan of carefully defining the boundaries of any creative project and see it as freeing rather than confining. (Saturn sq Sun, sextile Moon, trine Venus)
diane~
Hmm, I can feel a rant about cusps building now… thanks Diane
“Sloppy thinking.”
Hell, yes. I’m seeing just a general sense of this out there. “This sign is great, and yours suuucks.” UGH.
So glad you’ve brought astrological prejudices up, Lady D, because, my God, it is fueling the fire in my belly. Fueling!
So glad you’ve brought astrological prejudices up, Lady D, because, my God, it is fueling the fire in my belly.
LOL, Deb! Part of what brought this on for me was reading various astro posts and running across references to various patterns in the sky that made me go check to see what i had missed. Sensationalism is on the rise and I don’t expect this to change for quite some time.
diane~
This is very interesting. I’ve always read that out-of-sign aspects are still aspects so I tend to look at the numbers, even though my limited interpreting skills make it a bit harder to understand. But I suppose it makes sense to go with the numbers, given the big foundations of Maths and Astronomy present in Astrology. On the other hand, one cannot ignore that this is an Art of Interpretation.
I’m curious about tomorrow and I’m still about 8 posts behind in your blog. Can’t seem to catch up, you produce a lot!
Yes, out-of-sign aspects are still aspects – I know because I have an out-of-sign Sun-Saturn square natally.
What I’m curious about is the difference in transits when the planet changes signs. For instance, once Uranus moves into Aries, it will be changing from a waxing/partial aspect to waning inconjunct to my Sun. Aries opposes Libra by sign even though it will be another 8 years~ before it opposes my Sun by degree. SO . . . will I still be feeling the inconjunct with it’s “yes but”? Or will the Aries effect be dominate?
Right now Jupiter is clouding the issue as it is at 28 degrees, closing on 29 degrees (Sunday, then into Virgo on June 6). At any rate, we have an excellent opportunity to observe the differences between the anaretic degree & the critical degree in Pisces & Aries. Adding to our personal empirical data base is so important for all astrologers. If we can say I know how this works because I’ve experienced it first hand, it is a very good thing!
End of lecture . . .
diane~
Oh, sorry, I hadn’t understood what you meant. Thanks for the explanation
I try to use my common sense in everything so I think it does make sense that, for instance, you feel the Aries-Libra opposition on your Sun even if Uranus is still not opposite by degree. But only with tons of experience do we get clearer about these things.
Sensationalism! That’s it!
Well, I’m glad you’re here to counteract that
. I’m a fan.
A thought that flitted through my head while reading:
If sign does trump orb, then wouldn’t planets out of orb but aspecting by sign start being more important?
Oh, astrology… just when I think I have something figured out, I learn something new.
Hey SaDiablo!
If sign does trump orb, then wouldn’t planets out of orb but aspecting by sign start being more important?
Still need that numbers (orb) connection, especially for transits. In synastry, I like to do a quick comparison by sign for the Sun, Moon, Mercury, Venus & Mars. That works surprisingly well because those are energies we express as individuals.
One of the great things about astrology, is there is always something new to learn!
diane~
I was so focused on Uranus and Jupiter sextile to my natal Mars (along with an ongoing square from Neptune and Chiron, and trine from Saturn and pAsc), that I missed the inconjunct from Uranus to my Mercury at 0 Virgo. What does an inconjunct from Uranus in Aries do? Some altered thinking needed? It also inconjuncts my Jupiter (therefore it’s a yod I guess).
What does an inconjunct from Uranus in Aries do? Some altered thinking needed? It also inconjuncts my Jupiter (therefore it’s a yod I guess).
You’re right. Uranus is the apex of a Yod with your natal Mercury-Jupiter sextile as the base. Take note when Jupiter joins Uranus because I bet that will spark inspiration. New way of looking at an old 8th house issue?
diane~
Oh, interesting – right, when Jupiter joins up it may trigger something. We’ll see!
Interesting.
i.e. Sun in Libra 29 oppose Moon in Taurus 2 degrees Saturn 0 Scorpio conjunct Sun, Saturn, and Neptune, oppose Moon. etc.
I always use the aspects by numbers –but that may be because I have them in *my* chart
But,I do use wider orbs, always have (in synastry).
I agree that folks can try to force a connection in synastry if they’re desparately wanting to see them,:-) but I still say I can feel them myself.
Many astrologers disagree, some don’t.