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Observations: Pluto Thoughts for the Day

© Stephanie Pui-Mun Law

With a delicious Full Moon in Scorpio tomorrow, I got to thinking about Pluto, Scorpio’s ruler, and how we end up manifesting some of his delightful issues in our natal charts.

One of the common themes for most of us with strong Pluto natal signatures is control, of others, ourselves, our environments, etc. When I meet people with what is politely called “control issues” these days, I immediately wonder what Pluto is doing in their natal charts. Often he is conjunct the Ascendant or in hard aspect to the Luminaries. Everyone has Pluto somewhere but he has to prominent to be noticeable. It takes an aspect to the personal planets or Angles to force us to deal with Pluto because as a transpersonal planet he is very “other” and difficult to relate to.

I suppose having sextiles and trines does dilute Pluto’s stamp on us to a degree. The reason I say this is because I have a Moon-Pluto sextile and still notice the need to be in control of my emotions. It takes careful monitoring of my feelings to recognize when I’m shoving them down rather than dealing with them. (Neptune conjunct my Moon is NO help at all . . .)

Both of my step-daughters have Pluto in Libra, one has Pluto in her first house trine her Mercury and the other has Pluto conjunct the Ascendant square her Cappy Moon. It is very clear who is in charge in their marriages, particularly in the second case. She chose a very nice man who pretty much lets her run the whole show. You would not believe what his mother is like (she has yet to acknowledge her daughter-in-law’s existence . . . seriously!) The other day both families were visiting and when they left, both women were driving which about says it all.

It has occurred to me what happened when the girls were living with their bi-polar mother during their teen years brought out the need for control as adults. We are only now finding out how rough it was for them and how many responsibilities they assumed. At the time the grandparents flat refused to acknowledge their daughter had mental health problems. It was a sad, desperate time for the girls and I’m amazed how well they are doing now. So many secrets (Pluto) keep from their father and I, preventing us from helping out.

By the way, their dad has a Moon-Pluto trine and a Mars-Pluto square. The man definitely is one of the control issue group but he tends to be harder on himself than others. Their mom doesn’t have any major Pluto aspects although I suspect she has a Moon-Neptune square.

By the way, attempting to restrict or control uncertainties in our lives is very human and nothing to be ashamed of . . . one more reason to be kind and forgiving of our selves. Anyone else relate to this?

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21 comments to Observations: Pluto Thoughts for the Day

  • QueenofCups

    Oh yes I can relate – I have a tight Sun/Merc conjunction (7h) that squares my Pluto (10h). My father has a Sun/Plutosq as well – we knocked heads quite a bit when I was younger. I had major issues with my square until I discovered astrology. Now I think I have more control over it and I realize the power I have and use it more wisely (I hope). I was a volcano when I was younger. I still feel the need to be in control of everything, but I think I deal with it differently now that I’m older. I’m not as scary as I used to be.

    • Diane L

      Hey QueenofCups!

      I still feel the need to be in control of everything, but I think I deal with it differently now that I’m older. I’m not as scary as I used to be.

      It is very, very hard to learn how to unclench the fingers of control, isn’t it? Sometimes I think the best we can do is recognize we’re doing it. :P Not to mention how exhausting it is.

      Pluto transiting my Mars/Mercury/ASC taught me a few lessons in why it’s better to let others make their own mistakes . . .

      xoxoxo diane~

  • Debbie

    YES. Not sure what aspects of Pluto are drivng it, but have Pluto in the 8th Virgo and opposite Chiron trine my Cap rising. Really relate to having to work to know when I am stuffing and what my feeligns are. I have recently discovered rebirthing work and have been bothered by a comment the facilitator made about me not letting go of my emotions. Even my acupuncturist calls me stoic. I cried once though because it hurt so bad so there! LOL
    I don’t think people GET how hard it is for those of us who are locked in to come out. Even a little is SO MUCH. There is a bit of just not being aware. I think that is why I am so drawn to body type therapy as it helps so much to get out of my head. However, to the disappointment frustration of a few therapists so big cathartic release of emotions has not happened. :-)

    My mom’s pluto is Leo also 8th house aslo trine her Sag rising. She was a drama queen – there was never any room for my emotions. She took the stage and if I tried somehow it still was about her.

    • Diane L

      Hi Debbie,

      Your Sun is semi-sextile Pluto & Moon is inconjunct Pluto giving him plenty to work with! :)

      My mom’s pluto is Leo also 8th house aslo trine her Sag rising. She was a drama queen – there was never any room for my emotions. She took the stage and if I tried somehow it still was about her.

      No wonder you didn’t learn to let your feelings out! There was no room for them after your mom sucked up all the oxygen in the room. I never doubted my mom loved me but when I was a child she was so busy it was easier to withdraw rather than compete with my much louder siblings.

      xoxoxo diane~

  • Moon

    How about a conjunction of Moon Pluto? Do you consider that a control type personality? Also do you use wide orbs?

    • Diane L

      Welcome Moon!
      How about a conjunction of Moon Pluto? Do you consider that a control type personality?
      Yes. Often as children, Moon-Pluto people have excessively controlling parents. Lots of ‘em have mother issues . . . :( Judy Hall wrote a book called “The Hades Moon” about those with Moon-Pluto aspects.

      Also do you use wide orbs?
      Sun & Moon – 6 to 8 degrees, otherwise 4 or less for natal charts. For transits, I use smaller orbs, 2-3 degrees or less. For Neptune I only go with exact aspects (at least that’s the only time I really notice Neptune transits . . .)

      xoxo diane~

  • flip

    My oldest has a scorpio ascendant conj with pluto in scorpio in her first house. She loves to take charge. In real life and death situations, she is as cool as a cucumber. It is where she excels. Her pluto is opposite her sun and mercury. As much as she wants to take charge, she also tries to take care of everyone.

    • Diane L

      Hi flip!

      My oldest has a scorpio ascendant conj with pluto in scorpio in her first house. She loves to take charge. In real life and death situations, she is as cool as a cucumber. It is where she excels.

      Good for her! That’s a much needed skill. Though eventually she might need to pace herself. LOL How old is she?

      xoxo diane~

  • Joe

    Well, I think the Pluto/Venus conj in my Virgo 5th house is to my detriment, because I want creative pursuits to turn out (i.e. controlling) to be perfect (i.e. beautiful). On another note, I just noticed my natal Moon and Pluto are trine, as is also the case with my SO. We also both have Chiron completely unaspected. That’s interesting! He has Pluto at 29 Leo (Leo is also the Asc.) but whatever Plutonian control issues are present as not obvious to me. And his Moon opposes Neptune which explains a lot.

    • Diane L

      Hey Joe!

      Well, I think the Pluto/Venus conj in my Virgo 5th house is to my detriment, because I want creative pursuits to turn out (i.e. controlling) to be perfect (i.e. beautiful).

      That’s a great take on Pluto in Libra in the 5th House (though the orb is wide for conj with Venus). :)

      On another note, I just noticed my natal Moon and Pluto are trine, as is also the case with my SO.

      And both are out-of-sign trines. I love parallels between charts!

      He has Pluto at 29 Leo (Leo is also the Asc.) but whatever Plutonian control issues are present as not obvious to me.

      With Venus conj the ASC, it is easy for him to project affability & charm. :D

      We also both have Chiron completely unaspected.

      Sorry to say this is not the case . . . your Chiron closely opposes your Venus & his Chiron squares his Moon! Both instances make it easier to help others feel good about themselves than recognize the same positive qualities within.

      Enjoy the Scorp Full Moon!! :D

      xoxoxo diane~

      • Joe

        Oh I see. On Astrodienst, aspect lines are not drawn for Chiron and the angles unless you check the boxes, so I assumed wrongly. :)

        And you’re spot on with the Chiron assessment.

  • Eci

    I have been learning a LOT about Pluto as Pluto is currently conj my Asc (in Cappricorn). I have Pluto in Libra in the 10th house (square Asc). In the past three years I have been trying to turn my part time job (counselling & life coaching) into a career but I have been met with a lot of setbacks, false starts – I feel like I have been making one step forward 10 steps back. I am attributing this to a lot of fear on my part (to commit to it fully) and I feel that I need to let go of something… Not sure. I am also dealing with a Saturn in Libra transit (Sun in Libra and another 4 planets in Libra all in the 11th house)… All I can say is need a bit of a break or even better a breakthrough :) Thank you for such a wonderful article, I have only just discovered your blog.

    • Diane L

      Welcome Eci!
      I have been learning a LOT about Pluto as Pluto is currently conj my Asc (in Cappricorn). I have Pluto in Libra in the 10th house (square Asc). In the past three years I have been trying to turn my part time job (counselling & life coaching) into a career but I have been met with a lot of setbacks, false starts – I feel like I have been making one step forward 10 steps back. I am attributing this to a lot of fear on my part (to commit to it fully) and I feel that I need to let go of something… Not sure.

      Not easy to find the best way to present yourself as a professional person with all that Pluto influence. Do others react like you are coming on too strong when you don’t feel this is the case? It’s also tough to relax and be yourself too. Capricorn can be very driven to succeed for one reason or another.

      I am also dealing with a Saturn in Libra transit (Sun in Libra and another 4 planets in Libra all in the 11th house)… All I can say is need a bit of a break or even better a breakthrough :)

      Saturn transits can weigh a person down all right. Have you noticed changes in your circle of friends over the past couple of years? Saturn in Libra has been transiting my 11th House too and my women friends have all disappeared. Hopefully they will start showing up once Saturn moves on into Scorpio in October.

      Between your Saturn ruled ASC & transiting Saturn, that’s a lot of Saturn to contend with. The “two steps forward, one step back” is a typical pattern for Saturn. Don’t worry, eventually you will make it and succeed in style . . . with a solid foundation to build on! :D

      Good luck!!

      xoxo diane~

  • Rossa

    Good old Pluto. With his opposition to my natal Venus square Jupiter and square Mars my issue has always been with my femininity.

    I did a quiz that was designed to show if my brain was more female (left) or more male (right) and I was right in the middle, but more to the male side. With my father being the strongest parental influence my ‘masculine’ side is well developed. Also I had very little in the way of female role models in the sense that my mother, her mother and sisters were all very aggressive and masculine in their outlooks. Being feminine was frowned on so I had to find out about cosmetics, clothes and what being a woman is all about for myself.

    And I guess that goes to the control issue as my masculine side is the control side of my personality. It is only in the last few years that I have come to terms with my female side and starting to enjoy it. And letting a man in my life take control (some of the time!) ;-)

    • Diane L

      Hi Rossa! :D
      And I guess that goes to the control issue as my masculine side is the control side of my personality. It is only in the last few years that I have come to terms with my female side and starting to enjoy it. And letting a man in my life take control (some of the time!) ;-)

      Good for you! Since water & earth signs (fixed mode) dominate your chart, aggressive/masculine behaviors are a poor fit for you. Venus in Pisces prefers a gentle approach, even opposed by Pluto. It might have been easier for you to go along with the rest of the family growing up. Your Venus is also trine Neptune so finding the right image to project to please them was easy for you.

      I have always been intrigued with the failure of many to recognize the profound power of the feminine/water/earth side. The masculine/fire/air side is just louder . . . not more powerful. :D

      BTW – I would consider the orb between your Mars & Pluto too wide for them to be square. :)

      xoxoxo diane~

  • Yes I can relate to this. I feel for your step-daughters. It is very hard to grow up with a mentally ill parent. I have Moon square Pluto (as well my mother’s Saturn is conjunct my IC and trine my Moon). I finally read Judy Hall’s book this spring, almost 4 years after I bought it after your recommendation.

    Unraveling the damage has been really difficult but I feel I finally have solid ground to stand on. I had to feel all the anger first, and boy there is a lot of anger. Aries Mars is okay being angry but with it part of my Moon/Pluto/Mars T-square it scares other people, lol. That’s been the difficult part. Everyone has an opinion about how I need to move on. I don’t need to be told that I need to move on. 1st House Capricorn Moon–I’m not exactly waiting for instructions, yanno? LOL.

    • Diane L

      Hey Kashmiri!! :D :D

      Unraveling the damage has been really difficult but I feel I finally have solid ground to stand on. I had to feel all the anger first, and boy there is a lot of anger. Aries Mars is okay being angry but with it part of my Moon/Pluto/Mars T-square it scares other people, lol. That’s been the difficult part. Everyone has an opinion about how I need to move on. I don’t need to be told that I need to move on. 1st House Capricorn Moon–I’m not exactly waiting for instructions, yanno? LOL.

      No surprise you are dealing with layer upon layer of anger . . . nothing quite like feeling betrayed by the one who is “supposed” to love us the most. There is grief mixed in too. I see that in my step-daughters as they realize their mother will not be the grandmother for their kids they had hoped for. :(

      Keep at it!! {{{{Kashmiri}}}}

      That book of Judy Hall’s delivers quite a punch at times. I read it once through then set it aside for awhile. Lots to digest . . .

      xoxoxoxo diane~

  • Diane

    I was married to a man with Pluto square his Moon Mars conjunction in Scorpio. Had I known anything about astrology at the time, I would never have married him. He was very sexual, constantly unfaithful, and often filled with rage toward women. His real Mother, step mother and foster mother all deserted him in various ways. He controlled thru his sexuality and charm. My experience with him was dreadful although we did have two exceptional sons for whom I will be ever grateful!

    • Diane L

      Hi Diane!

      I was married to a man with Pluto square his Moon Mars conjunction in Scorpio. Had I known anything about astrology at the time, I would never have married him. He was very sexual, constantly unfaithful, and often filled with rage toward women. His real Mother, step mother and foster mother all deserted him in various ways.

      Good Lord! He sounds like a joy & a delight. Hope you got out in one piece w/your boys. Was he physically violent towards you & the children? Pluto sq Moon-Mars is a hard, hard aspect to live with. {{{{Diane}}}}

      xoxoxo diane~

  • flip

    Hi Diane, my eldest turned 25 during the Scorpio full moon.